Interview with Sok Kret, Special Education Project Administrator @ Epic Arts

Sok Kret is a staff member at Epic Arts. He works as an administrator with the Special Education Project. Sok is also a victim of a landmine in Cambodia and lost both his arm when he was 7 years old. He has experienced discrimination and isolation throughout his life, but is determined to show people what he can do.

Sok Kret, Special Education Project Administrator @ Epic Arts

Interview Thoughts and Comments

How would you describe inclusive arts?

Inclusive arts is many different kinds of arts from different places and different styles mixed together and used by people with disabilities and without disabilities - everyone from a variety of situations and backgrounds

What do you think are the things that you do or think that make successful inclusive arts happen at Epic Arts?.... Can you give me an example?

In my job in the Special Education Project I work with the children to show them what they can achieve, sometimes I have to show them how they can do something first and then they try it themselves. I have to give them the confidence to try something and show them that there are many ways they can do something. I join the students with art and also with dance and I like both of these as we get to explore what the children can do and we celebrate the many things that they can do.

In my house I have set up my own school as I always wanted to be a teacher, but I was never allowed to because I have a disability. I saw many children who did not go to school and that wanted to, so I made my own classroom where I could teach English. This means the children can come and learn and I can teach. They learn English, but they also learn that I can teach and that people with disabilities can have important jobs like teaching. I started with just 4 children at my school and my father made me benches for the students. But now my class has got bigger and I have 38 students who come to my school at night.

“They learn English, but they also learn that I can teach and that people with disabilities can have important jobs like teaching.”

I try to share the idea of being inclusive and creative at my school, I want the children to learn about this way of thinking as I would like to see Cambodia become like Epic Arts, to accept and value everyone and to do good work with everyone. I also want people to experience more arts as well so they can discover their creativity and expression.

What do you think other people need to do or think to make successful inclusive arts happen?

I think that you need to be very aware of who you are working with and have well-prepared and planned activities for all the people in your class. Some people might need things to be adapted so they can join with the others, but this is fun and I like seeing all the ways in which this can be done. One example is a student in the Special Education Project who cannot move his arms well, he does not have much strength in his hands and so he cannot hold a paintbrush. I do not want to hold it for him as I want him to paint, so sometimes we cover his hands in paint and he can move them around on paper and we have also used a box and a ball with paint on it that he can move and paint with. The ball rolls as he moves the box and the paint makes a picture painted by him. He is always very pleased when he sees what he has created by himself.

“It is very important in inclusive arts to not decide what a person can do before they try to do it themselves.”

I also think people need to be honest with each other and tell each other when something can be improved or be better. I find that people tell me that what I do is good a lot of the time, but they are not being honest with me as they fell sorry for my as I have no arms. I want to say to people unless you tell me how I can be better or how I can improve something, I cannot learn and I cannot grow. I do not want people to protect me and not be honest with me, as it does not help me.

It is very important in inclusive arts to not decide what a person can do before they try to do it themselves. If we tell people they will not be able to do something, they might believe it and never try it and they might have actually been able to do it.

Have you ever experienced this yourself and can you give me an example?

To teach was always my dream as I see that education is the most important thing for a country and for each person, I think education can develop a community and a country and I have always thought this. I wanted to be a teacher, but when I finished school and went to apply to be a teacher I was told I could not train as a teacher as I have no arms. Even when I showed them I could read and write and write on a board, all the same things as a teacher, they said not, it is not allowed in the law. They said I am not allowed by the Ministry of Education to be able to teach, as I have no arms, it is just not allowed. Many of my friends applied to be teachers and they went to train, but the Ministry would not let me become a teacher because I have a disability.

“They said I am not allowed by the Ministry of Education to be able to teach, as I have no arms, it is just not allowed.”

This made me very sad and angry, as I knew I could do the job and it is my passion, but people thought I was not good enough because I have no arms. But now I have my own school I have proved people wrong. When my students first came to the school, they thought I would not be able to teach them and they could not understand how I could write with no hands. The children through I was strange and I think they were a little bit scared at first, but once I started to teach, the children forgot about my disability. Now I am just their teacher and we have fun and learn and they come early before the lessons start, as they are very happy learning from me. I hope that they listen to me when I say they can do anything, if I can be a teacher when everyone said I cannot teach and now I can, then they can do anything they want to do.

“I can do many things and do not like it when, people decide for me and say I cannot.”

I think when people are told they cannot do something or that they are not good enough to do something, they start to believe it. I never believed it and whenever someone tells me I cannot do something, I find a way to do it. I was always told I couldn’t learn to ride a bicycle, so I was determined to do it. I would practice in the dark at night so no one could see me. I had to try and try and eventually I could do it. Then people said I could not ride a motorbike, but I can, I adapted my Moto and now I can ride it. I can do many things and do not like it when, people decide for me and say I cannot.

“I hope that they listen to me when I say they can do anything, if I can be a teacher when everyone said I cannot teach and now I can, then they can do anything they want to do.”

I think the work Epic Arts does is very important as it shows everyone what people can do and then people in Cambodia learn about the possibilities. I hope when people have seen the performances or workshops that we do that they will think differently and things will start to change for people like me in Cambodia.

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What has this told me about the inclusive arts practice within this activity at Epic Arts? What are the key themes?

Confidence

Sok talks about how in his work he sees that it is part of his job to give the children he works with the confidence to explore and try new things. First he shows them what they could do and then they try while he encourages them. This builds their confidence until they believe in their ability.

Leaders with Disabilities

Sok is a leader with a disability both at Epic Arts and at his self-made school in his local village. He talks about how by being a teacher for he student he not only teaches them English, but he also teaches them about the abilities of people with disabilities and that they can be leaders in society in Cambodia

Inclusive Ambassador

Sok is an inclusive ambassador in his community through his school. He says he wants his students to learn about being inclusive so that one-day Cambodia can become an inclusive environment like Epic Arts. He knows it is important to share the message that every person counts to the wider community.

Knowledge

Sok explains that he thinks it is important to be well planned for an inclusive lesson and to be prepared for all the different needs of the students in a lesson. He knows he needs the right knowledge and needs to be prepared in order for an inclusive arts class, or any inclusive class to be successful.

Adaptability

Sok shares a powerful example of adapting an activity so a student can independently take part and create. He explains about one student who paints using a ball and a box so that he can have control over what he creates, even though he finds it hard to hold a paintbrush.

High Quality

Sok talks about how its important that people are honest with him and not let him do poor quality work because of his disability, He wants to achieve high quality in all that he does, but cannot do this if people do not treat him like everyone else and tell him where he can improve. He wants equal treatment between everyone regardless of ability or situation.

A ‘I Can’ Attitude

Sok has an ‘I Can’ attitude that has been with him from a young age. He wanted to be a teacher with the government but was told he could not because he had a disability. He knew he could, so he built his own school. He was told he couldn't ride a bicycle or motorbike, so he went out and learnt how to do it.

See Ability

Sok recognized the importance of not deciding what someone can or cannot do before they have tried it. He has experienced this growing up and chose not to listen to others, but he wants others to learn to focus on people’s abilities, not make choices for people before they have had the chance to try something.

Sharing

Sok highlights the importance of sharing the creative work at Epic Arts so that people can see inclusive arts and acceptance in action in Cambodia. Through the work, people can understand the capabilities of all people and it can encourage others to try new things that they thought they could not do before.

Disability in Cambodia

Sok's experience growing up and wanting to be a teacher but not being allowed because of his disability is a common one here in Cambodia. This stops people with disabilities from being involved in society and this idea that people with disabilities do not have an ability to do jobs others can is one with which many of the staff at Epic Arts have struggled with in the past.