Interview with Inclusive Arts Student - Chamreoun @ Epic Arts

Today I interviewed another student on the Inclusive Arts Course at Epic Arts called Chamreom. Chamreoun is non-disabled and has been studying on the course for 18 months.

Inclusive Arts Student - Chamreoun @ Epic Arts

Interview Thoughts and Comments

How would you describe inclusive arts?

Inclusive arts means that people with and without disabilities work together through different art forms. Inclusive arts can mix together many different people who have a love for the arts and it is about the arts and people’s ideas, not about people’s ability.

What do you think are the things that you do or think that make successful inclusive arts happen at Epic Arts?.... Can you give me an example?

I do not have a disability but I work equally with the other students to support them and they support me, I am not there to help them dance or create art, but I am part of the group and equal. What we do is inclusive arts, we all have creative ideas and all create art and dance and drama. I do not make the art and the students with disabilities copy, we all give our ideas; everyone’s ideas are included and valued…..We are inclusive!

What do you think other people need to do or think to make successful inclusive arts happen?

We respect each other and support each other when we create work. We accept the people we work with and work as a team and corporate with each other. We make things that are good quality with good skill in different areas together. We are inspired by what each others does and this makes us think of new ideas when we make art and performances. Different bodies move differently and this makes new things and these new things give us all other ideas, it just keeps moving around like that.

In our classes we sometimes start with an idea from someone and then we all learn this way of dancing or doing art and this then becomes the way we move or paint or draw and it make something new that we have not tried before. If someone cannot move their legs then their movements are different to someone who can move their legs, but this creates something new that would not have happened without the first person creating their idea.

To dance or move together with someone who uses a wheelchair, I do not have to get in a wheelchair myself to do learn that persons movements, just like they do not need to stand like me, but together we can work out a new way to make a movement that is similar to each other, or is adapted either way.  If we had the same bodies it would be easy to just copy a movement, but different bodies make different things and it is a very different creative style. We are equal in creating, we all come up with an idea and create something together by mixing ideas. Sometimes people think that it is the people without disabilities that have the ideas, but it is not true with our group. Everyone creates things for each other, for example in dance, sometimes I choreography ideas and sometimes a wheelchair user does, we are all thinking and creating and sharing.

Have you ever experienced this yourself and can you give me an example?

We once did an arts class where we all drew in the same way as one of the other students. This student had difficulty holding a pen to draw, so he made dots on his paper instead of drawing lines. We all learnt his style and made art in the same way, the results were really interesting and they were something new we would not have done without the original inspiration from the student who showed us how. I also see that in our movement classes the people who use a wheelchair cannot jump with their legs like I can, but they jump with their arms instead, they adapt and they can jump.

What do you think people do or think that can stop successful inclusive arts from happening?

Sometimes people do not understand or they have the wrong attitude. In Cambodia people see me working with people with a disability and they think I am there to help them do things, to make art and be creative, but they are wrong. Last week I went out with my friend who is a wheelchair user from the course and a person asked what he did at Epic Arts and he said  ‘I am a performer and an artist.’ The person said to my friend, ‘But how can you dance, you are in a wheelchair. Do the other people help you to dance, does this boy (Chamroeun) help you to dance?’.  My friend said ‘No I use my energy and my power to dance, I can do it myself, anyone can if they try.’ Then my friend said to the other person, ‘If you do not believe me, you should come to Epic Arts and see what we do, you will be amazed!’

Some people don't understand people with disabilities, in Cambodia people feel sad for these people or treat them badly, but they are people, they may look or move in a different way, but they should be accepted and treated the same. People with disabilities should be treated the same, not differently in a bad or good way. They should not be isolated or ignored or thought of a stupid, but also they should not be treated as special.

We can all support and adapt things for people with disabilities, but we should not give them special treatment, if we are to accept people with disabilities, we should not change the way we behave such as not shout at them or tell them when they do something wrong, this is not equal, we can support but not give special treatment. I am not disabled but I need support from people too, but I do not need to be treated as special or for people to be scared to tell me when I do something wrong or when I am rude, this is the same for everyone and it is how this works at Epic Arts. I feel I am accepted in the same way as someone with a disability here, they do not get more respect than me, but the same.

In Cambodia people with disabilities do not know what they can do and I want to do more performances, create more pieces of art and go to the villages and show people that firstly people with disabilities can do things and secondly that people with and without disabilities can work together and learn from each other, not non-disabled helping disabled people but be together as a community.

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What has this told me about the inclusive arts practice within this activity at Epic Arts? What are the key themes?

Equality

Chamreoun explains that within the Inclusive Arts Course, he is a non-disabled student, but that he has an equal role within the group. He is not there as a ‘helper’, but as an artist working alongside everyone else. Chamreoun says that part of accepting all people is treating them the same as everyone else and seeing them as people the same way. He points out that we should not treat a person with a disability any differently that someone without a disability and this includes shouting at someone, or telling them they are doing something wrong, we should not give ‘special’ treatment, but the same treatment to all.

Individual Creativity

Chamreoun says that when they are creating work in Dance, Drama or Art, then he does not make the work and have the ideas so that he can teach them to people with disabilities, but that everyone has individual creative ideas that are shared and combined.

Respect

Chamreoun says that as part of the Inclusive Arts Course, the students all respect each other in the work that they do

Acceptance

Chamreoun says that as a group they accept each other’s differences and individuality in order to work together.

Creative Interaction Cycle

Chamreoun talks about how the creative process works on the Inclusive Arts Course, where new ideas are created, adapted and changed and then passed on which inspires another ideas. He says that this interaction ‘keeps moving around’, it is almost as if the ideas bounce from person to person, generating a new shape each time they land. Chamreoun also shares an example of the create interaction cycle when he talks about students learn new styles from each other that are a result of their physically. In sharing these styles and adaptations, new elements are discovered.

Adaptability

Chamreoun explains that when he is working with someone with a wheelchair, he does not have to get in a wheelchair himself to be able to work with him or her, but he can adapt the movement that the person is making to suit his own body. This idea of adapting happens the other way too, Chamreoun creates a movement and then the person in the wheelchair generates a fresh movement that is adapted to work with his or her body.

Disability in Cambodia

Chamreoun talks about people’s attitudes towards him and his friends on the Inclusive Arts Course in Cambodia. People see that he is with people with disabilities and think that he must be there to help them. He says that people are surprised to hear that the other people on the course with disabilities are part of an arts team as they think that they cannot be capable of this.

Share

Chamreoun expresses his determination to share more creative work with people in local villages in Cambodia to show that people with disabilities are very capable and can be a part of society and also that disabled and non-disabled people can work equality together.

Community

Chamreoun uses the word community to describe the way in which disabled and non-disabled people can come together, not as the ‘incapable ‘and the ‘helpers’, but as a community, a team moving in the same direction and learning from each other through a two-way dialogue.